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Talk:Voyager-Kazon conflict
Concept This is poorly named and another "made up" battle article title that MA really should scoff at... see canon ttitles like Kazon and . --Alan 14:57, October 30, 2009 (UTC) :Can you think of a better name to call it? And it is not "made up," Voyager had a two season long conflict with the Kazon and it's a major part of the ships history, hence why I created the article. If you read it you'll see it covers several battles. --Nero210 18:59, October 30, 2009 (UTC) ::He didn't say the battle was made up he said the title was made up, which it is ... at no point was it referred to as the "Voyager-Kazon conflict." It is a non-canon term and therefore should not be used on MA; that is the point he is making. --From Andoria with Love 19:08, October 30, 2009 (UTC) :So what is my article gonna be deleted now? I never heard the term "Borg-Species 8472 War" on the show either but nobody is challenging it. Or "Federation-Klingon War of 2372-73" I don't recall that name either. --Nero210 19:28, October 30, 2009 (UTC) :::Other similar articles existing is not a reason to make others like them in and of itself. It is possible those should be renamed or otherwise altered as well. Perhaps the article could be called "Kazon history", and expanded to include what we know of it(how they overthrew the Trabe, etc.)--31dot 20:39, October 30, 2009 (UTC) ::::I'm not sure exactly what Alan is talking about but I get the impression that he views these are non-canon fan articles rather than canon. Using this one as an example the conflict may have been one but in-universe wasn't ever considered a conflict - unlike the Battle of Wolf 359 which was referenced in the series several times. This is more or less an observed collection of instances where Voyager and the Kazon had words with each other. More original research than anything actually stated in canon. (Yes I understand all the information comes from canon sources but it's compiled through observation of a perceived conflict rather than an actual one stated as such in canon) — Morder (talk) 20:54, October 30, 2009 (UTC) :I might as well just stop editing. Everything I do is either gonna get reverted or deleted. Fine, do whatever you want with this one. --Nero210 20:56, October 30, 2009 (UTC) ::::I only stated what I think Alan is trying to say not anything against your article or any other article. — Morder (talk) 21:14, October 30, 2009 (UTC) :::::I share some of Nero's frustration. This isn't the first time this name problem has been brought up, but the people bringing it up never seem to want to make a suggestion of a title they would find acceptable. I don't think it's really Nero's job to come up with one, he's already tried and it has been rejected. What would Alan or Shran find an acceptable title? Many of these subjects, battles, conflicts, whether formally named in canon or not, need articles if we are going to call ourselves complete. So you guys are basically saing, "bad boy," but not giving any suggestion on what to do to become good. --OuroborosCobra talk 21:16, October 30, 2009 (UTC) ::::Agreed. Should probably start a forum if one hasn't started already... — Morder (talk) 21:19, October 30, 2009 (UTC) :::I am not agreeing or disagreeing with Cobra with this statement, but I will point out I did offer a suggestion in this case.--31dot 21:24, October 30, 2009 (UTC) :::I agree it should be discussed.--31dot 21:25, October 30, 2009 (UTC) This topic has been contested several times over the last 5+ years, this is hardly a new topic: Talk:Destruction of the Odyssey (resolved), Talk:Operation Return, Talk:Battle of Andoria (resolved), Talk:Battle in the Bassen Rift, Talk:Battle of the Briar Patch, Talk:Battle of the Briar Patch (II), Talk:Search for the Xindi weapon (resolved), First Battle of Deep Space 9, Talk:Invasion of Septimus III, Talk:Battle of Rondac III, and Battle of Torros III, just to name a few. Probably some the best points that can be pulled from some of these are: "This named appears to be another one of those "made up" battles...as I really don't see a need to list every skirmish a single starship had as a "Battle of," unless it was officially designated as such in context..." and "...people get excited about these incidents and want to create articles but there are too many small engagements to start naming them all "battles", esp. without a canon reference." With that said, there is no canon reference to this name, and from a short-hand count this would apply to about 20 of said conflicts. --Alan 19:13, November 7, 2009 (UTC) ::::::I seem to remember there being a line about "conflicts with the Kazon" in , but I could be completely wrong. Either way, Alan's point about this not being an isolated issue is valid, and short of one of the writers showing up, I'm at a loss of what to do about it, since I don't think it's a good idea to just delete them all. - 19:59, November 7, 2009 (UTC) :::::::For what it's worth, I find it useful and interesting to present/organise/group this information in this way. I also think it notable in the context of the series. Is there perhaps a production source (DVD special features, Voyager Companion...) that refers to this overall conflict? Setacourse 19:46, November 12, 2009 (UTC)